This was at one time posted at:
http://groke.beckman.uiuc.edu/AVC/Papers/Renewal/wimber.htm. It is now on its new server at: http://www.avc.vineyard.org/board/wimber.html.
John Wimber Responds to Phenomena
The following is an excerpt taken from a letter by John Wimber
responding to questions regarding some of the phenomena experienced in
recent Vineyard meetings.
Table of Contents
My views as to the issue of "roaring" under the anointing
- I would say that there is no biblical or theological framework for such
phenomena. I don't see anywhere in the New Testament where Jesus and / or
the apostles encouraged such phenomena or encountered such phenomena.
Therefore, I think these kinds of things have to be put in a category
of"non-biblical" and "exotic."
- However, there have been some revival reports in church tradition where
people have made various and sundry "animal noises" (or noise; that could
labeled as such, though I doubt making animal sounds was the intent of the
people). For instance, at the Cane Ridge Revival in Kentucky during the
Second Great Awakening, there were a number of people that did so.
Furthermore, I understand that Charles Finney had some sort of experience
where he made a kind of "roaring noise," although I don't think he, in
retrospect, equated it with a lion. He did equate it, however, with an
anointing from God that transformed his life and ministry.
- I've had, to date, seven or eight testimonies from people who have
"roared." Here are the conclusions they drew from the experience:
- There was a sense of God's indignation at the state of the church and
the impact of the enemy's presence in the church. As a consequence, people
responded with a "prophetic roar," which was sort of an "announcement" of
God's intention to take back territory.
- Furthermore, it seemed to affirm the issue of the Lord's authority in
their lives and ministries, and as a consequence they've been very excited
about the potential for more powerful ministry in the future.
- It seems to me that nearly all of them have equated this with some sort
of prophetic experience, either personal anointing for prophecy and/or
prophetic in the sense that God is saying to the church, "Rise up, and take
back the land / people / things that the enemy has one way or another
wrongfully usurped control of.
- However, having said that, I must point out that there is some
disagreement in our circles here in the Vineyard.
- There are those that are very enthusiastic endorsers of the experience
and I think are, as a consequence, even encouraging others in this kind of
experience. I strongly feel that it is excessive to do so, in that again I
know of no biblical mandate for encouraging anyone to "roar."
However; based on the rubric of "bless what the Father's doing," I suppose,
if I were in a ministry context and somebody started "roaring," I would
bless what I thought the Father was doing, regardless of the "roaring" or
any other manifestation. Keep in mind, however, we do not equate!ate
phenomena with God; we see these usually as human responses to God.
- On the other hand, there are people who sharply disagree with the notion
that anything such as this kind of phenomena could be perceived to be
something of God, and would quickly point out that there's no biblical
support for equating the experience with God, and I would have
to agree that this, indeed, has to be viewed as an exotic and non-biblically
endorsed experience;
Having said that, I do not, personally, hold the opinion that this is
"demonic" and / or necessarily "divine." I put this in the category of
"pondering / I don't know." I am looking for, in the aftermath, the affects
of the experience to see how it relates to the person's life. If we see
fruit (i.e. Mt. 7:15ff,
I Cor. 14,
Acts 5:33ff,
I Jn. 4:1-3),
then I suppose
I would accept the notion that, if the people who have had the experience
are advancing, perhaps it was something from God.
In light of all the above, here my are my views on "phenomena"
- I cannot endorse or even encourage this experience in our movement and
ministry, but at the same time I recognize that it is happening and I would
just leave it in the same category as I have of people shaking, or falling
or having other kinds of exotic phenomena that may have some limited
biblical representation. Therefore, this is not necessarily anything that
we ought to equate as "always" something of God, or even "sometimes"
something of God, though it may be a reaction to the Spirit's activity. I
think that we ought to endorse and encourage the "main and the plain things"
of scripture: i.e. salvation, sanctification, justification by faith and the
consequent experiences of such, where people would have testimonies of how
they are advancing in their initial relationship with God and then moving on
in progression with God.
- I feel that it's very important that we direct this "refreshing" and
"enabling" move of the Spirit to the New Testament works of the church, that
is to say, having been refreshed, we now must channel these people into work
that would express that refreshing in solid, biblical context. That is to
say that they should be encouraged to begin interceding, sharing their faith
in an evangelistic context: they should be feeding the hungry, ministering
to the poor, the widow, the divorcee, etc., etc. I believe that if we
channel this energy away from a "bless me" kind of focus to a "bless them"
kind of focus we will indeed be utilizing this fresh anointing in a
biblically appropriate fashion.
Finally, I want to close by saying this. I feel that the exuberant and
initial response of many in this area is well taken, and I'm happy for their
testimonies. I just don't want to make our meetings a focus on "phenomena."
I would like to make our meetings focused on the Word and works of the
Spirit.
Now, having said all that, I recognize that there are certain manifestations
of the Spirit that have gone on in our meetings for fifteen years that we
supposed were demonic in origin. And there have been times in the past
where we've attempted to cast demons out of people who made "animal noises."
On some occasions demons manifested and we did cast them out and on other
occasions we were puzzled by the lack of deliverance.
Therefore, I think in the past we've had a simplistic view of all of these
kinds of things. These new phenomena and their apparent "fruit" have been a
circumstance that has caused me to stop and think and review again, my
presuppositions as they relate to this all.
Vineyard Internet Ministries
Updated: August 1, 1996
people that has seen this page since 8/10/96. . . . . .
Counter Stats
Thanks to Web Counter for the use of page counter. http://www.digits.com